From jeff at bioinformatics.org Thu Jul 5 17:31:38 2001 From: jeff at bioinformatics.org (J.W. Bizzaro) Date: Fri Feb 10 19:20:52 2006 Subject: [Pipet Devel] Mono Message-ID: <3B44DCBA.497484EE@bioinformatics.org> On Monday, Ximian (Gnome) will announce a system called "Mono", which is supposed to be compatible or competing with MS .NET. Recall that Gnome Gnotices changed the title of our announcement last year that said Piper is a GNU/GNOME alternative to .NET. It'll be interesting to see what they come up with and if there are any similarities to Piper. Also, I'm giving a talk about Piper at the OMG meeting/OiBC conference on Tuesday. Jeff -- J.W. Bizzaro jeff@bioinformatics.org Director, Bioinformatics.org http://bioinformatics.org/~jeff "As we enjoy great advantages from the inventions of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours; and this we should do freely and generously." -- Benjamin Franklin -- From jeff at bioinformatics.org Fri Jul 13 02:51:34 2001 From: jeff at bioinformatics.org (J.W. Bizzaro) Date: Fri Feb 10 19:20:52 2006 Subject: [Pipet Devel] stuff Message-ID: <3B4E9A76.E77108A8@bioinformatics.org> Hey Pipers. Jarl, I'm sorry about not getting back to you sooner. I attended that conference earlier this week and presented Piper. The talk went well. I spoke about Piper for about 30 minutes and took some questions. Some people seemed very interested in it. Have you seen all the hub-bub about .NET alternatives this week? I'm feeling a bit disturbed at the attention these projects (3 of them now) are getting, and that the FSF has endorsed 2 of them. I had been shouting "Piper is an Open Source .NET alternative!" earlier last year, and we got nearly no attention from it (of course then I had to stop saying that). Also, I wanted to get official GNU project standing from the FSF, and now it seems we may have missed that opportunity, at least with respect to Piper being a .NET alternative. One word: argh! Maybe 2 words: hold me. ;-) Anyway, maybe now we should just forget about the direct .NET comparisons (it's just too late for that) and focus on whatever cool things we want Piper to be. Jarl, I'll get back to you about the compiling problems. I have some meetings today, but I'll get to it right away. Cheers. Jeff -- J.W. Bizzaro jeff@bioinformatics.org Director, Bioinformatics.org http://bioinformatics.org/~jeff "As we enjoy great advantages from the inventions of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours; and this we should do freely and generously." -- Benjamin Franklin -- From jeff at bioinformatics.org Fri Jul 13 02:54:33 2001 From: jeff at bioinformatics.org (J.W. Bizzaro) Date: Fri Feb 10 19:20:52 2006 Subject: [Pipet Devel] [Fwd: PNSO] Message-ID: <3B4E9B29.EAB9C046@bioinformatics.org> This is from Nile of dLoo. I don't know what to make of their "on again, off again" interest in Piper. Anyway, the "words" programming language seems interesting. Jeff -------------- next part -------------- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: nile@dloo.com Subject: Re: PNSO Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 12:55:05 -0700 (PDT) Size: 3475 Url: http://bioinformatics.org/pipermail/pipet-devel/attachments/20010713/ccf591cc/attachment.mht From jeff at bioinformatics.org Fri Jul 13 03:05:28 2001 From: jeff at bioinformatics.org (J.W. Bizzaro) Date: Fri Feb 10 19:20:52 2006 Subject: [Pipet Devel] stuff References: <3B4E9A76.E77108A8@bioinformatics.org> Message-ID: <3B4E9DB8.B4051269@bioinformatics.org> We can look at it this way: Would Piper's acceptance by the FSF et al have stopped Mono and .GNU? Probably not. They probably would have come out with announcements exactly the same, ignoring Piper, and we would have said, "What are we, chopped liver?" There's an alternate name for Piper: Chopped Liver ;-) Jeff "J.W. Bizzaro" wrote: > > Have you seen all the hub-bub about .NET alternatives this week? I'm feeling > a bit disturbed at the attention these projects (3 of them now) are getting, > and that the FSF has endorsed 2 of them. I had been shouting "Piper is an > Open Source .NET alternative!" earlier last year, and we got nearly no > attention from it (of course then I had to stop saying that). Also, I wanted > to get official GNU project standing from the FSF, and now it seems we may > have missed that opportunity, at least with respect to Piper being a .NET > alternative. -- J.W. Bizzaro jeff@bioinformatics.org Director, Bioinformatics.org http://bioinformatics.org/~jeff "As we enjoy great advantages from the inventions of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours; and this we should do freely and generously." -- Benjamin Franklin -- From jeff at bioinformatics.org Fri Jul 13 11:53:30 2001 From: jeff at bioinformatics.org (J.W. Bizzaro) Date: Fri Feb 10 19:20:52 2006 Subject: [Pipet Devel] Re: Piper References: <20010713133007.13206.qmail@eklektix.com> Message-ID: <3B4F197A.610F3DE7@bioinformatics.org> Hi Jonathan! Thanks for writing back. Jonathan Corbet wrote: > > What is the development status of Piper? A quick glance through the > mailing list archives gives the impression that not much is happening, but > maybe it's all behind the scenes? Some of it is behind the scenes. We have four mailing lists now, so discussions get spread out a bit. But a few of the core developers are actually meeting in Denmark in two weeks for some hacking and discussions. And we recently started the "PiperNet Standards Organization": http://bioinformatics.org/pipernet/ "The PiperNet" is the name for the/any network created by Piper peers and compatible systems. The Standard's Org is a voting body which will publish API's and other standards. We even have a corporate member in the Organization: LogiLab, which develops the Narval intelligent agent system: http://www.logilab.org/ Their interests are in adding agents to the PiperNet, among some other interesting ideas. Piper probably has more code than any of the other projects mentioned on LWN, since this is a merger between three projects that date back several years. Altogether we have nearly 100,000 LOC's. Piper is certainly not vaporware. But we are not quite past 0.0.1, as a whole system, because a lot of our work has been in making the changes needed to get the three independent parts working together. I think that the biggest distinction is that Piper is not trying to copy .NET (neither cloning nor taking inspiration from). (We actually hadn't heard of .NET until a while after starting the project.) We are using the UNIX paradigm of "doing complex things by piping small tools". And we're really the first anywhere to try to represent this in a desktop-like GUI: http://bioinformatics.org/piper/screenshots/ We (this is my personal project) will even be developing our own desktop (called "The Pied Piper"), but since we are publishing standards, other *NIX desktops can be made PiperNet-compatible. Don't hesitate to ask, if you have any more questions. Cheers. Jeff -- J.W. Bizzaro jeff@bioinformatics.org Director, Bioinformatics.org http://bioinformatics.org/~jeff "As we enjoy great advantages from the inventions of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours; and this we should do freely and generously." -- Benjamin Franklin -- From jeff at bioinformatics.org Mon Jul 30 11:53:32 2001 From: jeff at bioinformatics.org (J.W. Bizzaro) Date: Fri Feb 10 19:20:52 2006 Subject: [Pipet Devel] freshmeat entry Message-ID: <3B6582FC.16B9ED28@bioinformatics.org> Jarl, I created an entry on Freshmeat for "Piper - PiperNet Reference". I know you had created one called "GNU Piper". Maybe we can use the one I created, so you may want to delete the GNU Piper one. Cheers. Jeff -- J.W. Bizzaro jeff@bioinformatics.org Director, Bioinformatics.org http://bioinformatics.org/~jeff "As we enjoy great advantages from the inventions of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours; and this we should do freely and generously." -- Benjamin Franklin --