Hi Jeff, Just a short inpression of me, I'll write a long detailed one later this evening, have to go out now. Basically I agree fully with you Jeff that Piper should get less dependancies, or put otherwise: Piper should requiere less external packages needed to install. A solution might be to bundle everything that's needed into Piper releases and make and install procedure that handles already availeble dependacies by not installing them. About the modulairity: to me Piper is just a set of specifications implemented by packages of software labeled 'Piper compliant' by us. There has to be an 'official' Piper package containing the default software for every layer (a GUI,DL,BL and PL). For now using Overflow++ for the PL seems most logical. Could change, like it can for every layer, when there are more implementations and we chose the 'best' whatever that might be. more on this later ;) Jarl