Gary mentioned Sash to me the other day. It too has a lot in common with Piper, but probably more on the BlueBox side of the collaborative. However, I don't particularly care for its dependency on such massive "libraries" as "Mozilla". ``Sash can be thought of as technology that maps the native Application Programming Interfaces (API's) provided by an operating system and it's particular Graphical User Interfaces to ones that are abstracted and straightforward enough to be useful to web page developers who use HTML, JavaScript and XML.'' http://oss.software.ibm.com/developerworks/opensource/sashxb/ Jeff